Luke your writing does such a great job of mixing the personal, the factual, and the analytical. For a movie I’ve never seen I understand it in a wider conversation that I don’t think I would’ve been able to hear before this. Such a talent!
Enlightening, as always. My own paternal grandfather enlisted in Australia and ended up in France - only briefly, however, since he was found to have serious varicose veins - the recruiters took anyone, apparently - and was sent back to England for surgery. He spent the rest of the war recovering, though in a book about WWI and Paris I suggested he might have briefly gone AWOL to enjoy the then-limited but still seductive joys of the City of Light - and of Dark.
I remember being shown OWALW during our GCSE history class, must have been about 1990, to general bafflement of the class. WWI was everywhere when I was at school, war poets, Black Adder IV, Charlie's War comics, trips to the Imperial War Museum.
Interesting. Were you taught the Blackadder/Donkeys view of the war? Or the revisionist approach? At school (at least for O level) we were very much taught the standard, A J P Taylor/Donkeys interpretation. It was only when I arrived at University to read Modern History that I discovered the revisionists- partly because I was lucky enough to have David French, a leading revisionist historian, as a tutor.
My history master at school- this was for O' Level, early 80s- had a pathological hatred of Haig and was a lover of Lloyd George (he was Welsh). Again, from an historical point of view, biased, unobjective 'history'. We deserved better than that. Incidentally, the late 60s Penguin cover of Taylor's First World War- brilliant design, very much of the period.
JFK was reportedly greatly impressed by Tuchman's The Guns of August combined with his experience during the October Missile Crisis of that year. American schools back then, of course, focused first on the folly of how the war started and then shifted to Woodrow Wilson trying to make the peace. In the US, Oh What A Lovely War was very much seen in the context of the war in Vietnam and the darker overtones and background notes were very much noted. Personally, I relished the introduction to what the men in the trenches were really singing and have been known over the years to strike up a chorus of "Gassed Last Night" or "They were only playing leapfrog".
A movie I haven't seen in the longest time Luke but I savoured this with great interest. Thought provoking and analytical as always, thank you for a wonderful Monday morning read!
Thank you. I've been thinking long and hard about the First World War for many years now... and the post includes some of my thoughts.... but, obviously, there is a great more to be said. It's an intensely complex subject.
I love the romanticism of War for the boys (and girls) in the movies and books, but having lived through WWII myself at my three years of age, I couldn't see or read anything about war for a long time. You can read, if you are interested in realities of war, my remembrance of war and after war situation in Russia in my memoir, WRONG COUNTRY. Larisa
Splendid essay as always. I think the influence of Vietnam and the anti-war movement must have been quite strong: it generalised from the specific of WW1 historiography to inter-generational conflict and lack of understanding, the sense of a pointless loss of life, the cynicism of political and military leaders and their heedlessness to the young people actually doing the fighting, and maybe a bit of the old military-industrial complex too.
Exactly. Actually, I think it was incredibly strong. The sense of futility. When, if you had asked a Tommy in 1918 why he was fighting, he would have said something along the lines of 'to defeat the Kaiser and defend the missus...' and when you read about German atrocities in Belgium, the Kaiser's regime ain't nice. Plus, despite everything, we (ie Britain) could not afford to let Germany have control of the Belgian ports- one of the reasons for the creation of Belgium as a neutral, buffer state? That said, all this is easy to say with hindsight...
Luke your writing does such a great job of mixing the personal, the factual, and the analytical. For a movie I’ve never seen I understand it in a wider conversation that I don’t think I would’ve been able to hear before this. Such a talent!
That is incredibly kind. Thank you. Really appreciate it.
I couldn’t have stated it better. Fully agree!
The bells of hell go ting a ling a ling.
Enlightening, as always. My own paternal grandfather enlisted in Australia and ended up in France - only briefly, however, since he was found to have serious varicose veins - the recruiters took anyone, apparently - and was sent back to England for surgery. He spent the rest of the war recovering, though in a book about WWI and Paris I suggested he might have briefly gone AWOL to enjoy the then-limited but still seductive joys of the City of Light - and of Dark.
And, the Australians played a major role in the final victory of 1918. Which ended the war.
I remember being shown OWALW during our GCSE history class, must have been about 1990, to general bafflement of the class. WWI was everywhere when I was at school, war poets, Black Adder IV, Charlie's War comics, trips to the Imperial War Museum.
Interesting. Were you taught the Blackadder/Donkeys view of the war? Or the revisionist approach? At school (at least for O level) we were very much taught the standard, A J P Taylor/Donkeys interpretation. It was only when I arrived at University to read Modern History that I discovered the revisionists- partly because I was lucky enough to have David French, a leading revisionist historian, as a tutor.
The same, our set text was AJP Taylor and we were shown the last episode of Blackadder goes Forth and the teacher said: 'this is how it was.'
God, that's scary. Bad history.
My history master at school- this was for O' Level, early 80s- had a pathological hatred of Haig and was a lover of Lloyd George (he was Welsh). Again, from an historical point of view, biased, unobjective 'history'. We deserved better than that. Incidentally, the late 60s Penguin cover of Taylor's First World War- brilliant design, very much of the period.
JFK was reportedly greatly impressed by Tuchman's The Guns of August combined with his experience during the October Missile Crisis of that year. American schools back then, of course, focused first on the folly of how the war started and then shifted to Woodrow Wilson trying to make the peace. In the US, Oh What A Lovely War was very much seen in the context of the war in Vietnam and the darker overtones and background notes were very much noted. Personally, I relished the introduction to what the men in the trenches were really singing and have been known over the years to strike up a chorus of "Gassed Last Night" or "They were only playing leapfrog".
A movie I haven't seen in the longest time Luke but I savoured this with great interest. Thought provoking and analytical as always, thank you for a wonderful Monday morning read!
Thank you. I've been thinking long and hard about the First World War for many years now... and the post includes some of my thoughts.... but, obviously, there is a great more to be said. It's an intensely complex subject.
I love the romanticism of War for the boys (and girls) in the movies and books, but having lived through WWII myself at my three years of age, I couldn't see or read anything about war for a long time. You can read, if you are interested in realities of war, my remembrance of war and after war situation in Russia in my memoir, WRONG COUNTRY. Larisa
Thank you for complement. By the way, have you seen Russian movie The Cranes are Flying about WWII, which got the Palme D'Or at 1958?
Splendid essay as always. I think the influence of Vietnam and the anti-war movement must have been quite strong: it generalised from the specific of WW1 historiography to inter-generational conflict and lack of understanding, the sense of a pointless loss of life, the cynicism of political and military leaders and their heedlessness to the young people actually doing the fighting, and maybe a bit of the old military-industrial complex too.
Exactly. Actually, I think it was incredibly strong. The sense of futility. When, if you had asked a Tommy in 1918 why he was fighting, he would have said something along the lines of 'to defeat the Kaiser and defend the missus...' and when you read about German atrocities in Belgium, the Kaiser's regime ain't nice. Plus, despite everything, we (ie Britain) could not afford to let Germany have control of the Belgian ports- one of the reasons for the creation of Belgium as a neutral, buffer state? That said, all this is easy to say with hindsight...